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Author Previous Topic: The freelance California Railway & Navigation Co Topic Next Topic: Early Railroad Equipment into the 50s
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railman28
Fireman



Posted - 06/04/2016 :  12:21:12 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Andre,
Though there are a thousand exceptions I find most builders followed the practices outlined in this Model Railroader drawing from the 80's;


My own railroad follows an exception. We have very sharp curves and loops climbing out of the Coquille Valley so our Moguls look a lot like the V&T's.

Download Attachment: wheel spacingresiz.jpg
49.58 KB


It's only make-believe

Country: USA | Posts: 4689 Go to Top of Page

railman28
Fireman



Posted - 06/04/2016 :  12:23:20 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
P.S. You should be able to get Mantua Parts from Yardbird hobbies.

It's only make-believe

Country: USA | Posts: 4689 Go to Top of Page

OK Hogger
Engine Wiper

Posted - 06/04/2016 :  12:33:05 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Bob!

Thanks for the diagrams! They are going into my "HO_TOC19/Resources" folder!

Also thanks for the tip on Yardbird Hobbies. I'll have to check them out to see what all is available. What would really help is an available source for the MDC 52" Baldwin drivers, flange, blind w/gear, and blind.

All fer now!



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OK Hogger
Engine Wiper

Posted - 06/04/2016 :  12:38:26 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Aw shucks... while I'm here I might as well post an inspirational link n' pin Colorado painting.

LOVE this painting by Howard Fogg. Substitute standard gauge for the narrow gauge and you're looking at a scene on my Colorado & Pacific! (Or at least it would be great to be able to produce such a scene in miniature!)




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OK Hogger
Engine Wiper

Posted - 06/05/2016 :  8:22:10 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Happy! Happy! Happy! Happy! Happy! Joy! Joy! Joy!



Just purchased an NIB Arbour Models Brooks Mogul kit off'n the Bay!!!!

Regretted letting one slip past me several months ago... and I wasn't even modeling steam then!

Sorry... just had to tell somebody!

OMG... hope it's not narrow gauge!!!




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railman28
Fireman



Posted - 06/06/2016 :  12:58:40 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Andre,
I wish you would of asked us about them first. They are poor kits. I have the the Brooks Mogul and the Sierra 10 wheeler. With a lot of work they can be built into acceptable looking models but Mechanically they are a disaster. The soft metal side rods and frames just do not work. Hagan is the only one I know of who has successfully built one and he had a new frame machined in brass.

But they are standard gauge.


It's only make-believe

Edited by - railman28 on 06/06/2016 12:59:45 AM

Country: USA | Posts: 4689 Go to Top of Page

OK Hogger
Engine Wiper

Posted - 06/06/2016 :  06:46:07 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Bummer. Didn't know to ask about them. Watched an Arbour Models Sylvania Central 4-6-0 unbuilt kit with some parts missing go for something like $175 on the Bay, so figured they ought to be reputable or they wouldn't be in such demand. So much for me and my col-surned thinkin'.

Hm. Sounds like I just bought a lifetime project! Perhaps an MDC chassis/mechanism to the rescue?

Ah well... 'ya win some, 'ya lose some!

On a lighter note:

Been doing a lot of clean out/selling off of my past junk collections in order to accelerate the funds for the C&P. Was digging up some old pics on my hard drive of some Sn3 models I was putting up for sale and found a pic of my first attempt (and only attempt thus far) at trying to learn to paint "Colorado-type" backdrops. This was painted some 15-20 years ago? (I AM gonna' have to paint some Colorado backdrops for the C&P, right?)

Anyway, looking at the pic of my first painting, I remembered how that as soon as I had painted these mountains, I saw many ways to improve them. (MANY ways.) Strangely, I'm looking forward to starting that learning process again and I hope I can improve from this point and eventually create some backdrops I can be okay with. For poops n' grins... here's a pic of my first attempt at the Rockies...



As for comments onthe painting: Be gentle on me, I'm a very fragile artist. :-)

Things I see that need improved on the foreground mountains:

* Too symetrical. (Almost all are shaped the same pyramidal shape and all have the same spire for a top.)

* Too dark on the gray.

* Need more relief in the clefts.

* Etc.

All fer now... off to work to go play with the 1:1 trains!

Andre



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railman28
Fireman



Posted - 06/06/2016 :  10:36:21 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I like the painting. The four sisters? a lot better than my backdrop painting

It's only make-believe

Country: USA | Posts: 4689 Go to Top of Page

OK Hogger
Engine Wiper

Posted - 06/06/2016 :  5:54:48 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Dang... and I threw it away eons ago. I could have signed it in some fancy way and sold it to you for an absurd amount of money and retired. Double dang.

(Seriously: Thanks for your kind words!)

FWIW: Getting home from work and pulling in the driveway today, sitting on the porch was a package with the MDC 52" diver Mogul kit!




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OK Hogger
Engine Wiper

Posted - 06/08/2016 :  9:32:56 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi All!

Received my Arbour Models Brooks Mogul kit today.

The good news:

* MOST of parts inside the box are still shrink wrapped or in sealed bags.

* The frame and cover plate for same appears to be straight and true.

* The main rods and side rods appear to be straight and square. However, I suspect I will replace those with some scratch built brass ones when the time comes to get serious about this kit.

* The 56" drivers are a welcomed variation to my roster. Wish those were still available.

* According to measuring the end within the shrink wrap with my dial calipers, the boiler appears it would take a NWSL 16 x 25 flat can motor, which measures 12mm across the flats.

HOWEVER... there is some "bad news":

* The wood cab parts are incomplete. There are no sides, front/rear... only the roof and under roof support. I figure the original owner botched the cab assembly and decided to chuck the entire project.

* It is designed to be tender drive. That will have to be addressed. (See above about the boiler inside dimensions!)

* The 16x25 can motor runs nice and slow with no cogging... but occasionally won't start on its own. (Have to spin the shaft with my fingers to get it going.) Could be that some break-in time running both directions will seat the brushes better... but still. Not cool.

In all, I still think I'm "okay" with my purchase, as I sort of figured it would be a "start here" kit, but it would have been nice if the cab parts were there. When the time comes that I'm ready to tackle the little Brooks, I will either need to:

* Scratch build a cab.

* Heavily modify an MDC Old Timer to fit (including modifying it into a peaked roof).

In addition I will want to:

* Fit a NWSL 16x25 flat can inside the boiler and regear it using a NWSL gear set.

* Install DCC/Sound and a speaker in the little tender.

No rush on any of the above. In fact, I doubt I'll even think about tackling this one until I'm well along with the entire C&P project... but that could change if'n I get the urge!

One thing's for sure: I really like the overall lines of the engine (going by the included scale drawings, and looking at the castings).

All fer now!

Andre



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TwinZephyr
New Hire

Posted - 06/08/2016 :  10:50:26 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Regarding those 56" drivers... Arbour's innovation was to use metal plating on plastic wheels to transmit electricity. You may be OK if you use a modern efficient motor. It might be better to plan on fabricating tire wipers for electrical pickup.

Those missing cab walls are not much more than plain wood sheet.



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OK Hogger
Engine Wiper

Posted - 06/08/2016 :  11:01:21 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hi Twinzephyr!

Metal plating on plastic wheels, huh? Well I'll be danged. Ain't that sumpthin'? Wonder how they hold up to use?

As for the cab: A loss of the printing on the wood, which would help keep things square and in relation to one another... but otherwise, I would prefer working with styrene, so not a terrible disappointment that most of the wood cab parts were missing.

Still... interesting kit. Not nearly as robust as an MDC Old Timer... but it IS something DIFFERENT than I have been working with in the past: MDC.

I am thinking about cutting out some of the parts from the shrink wrap, frame and cover plate mainly, and seeing how flimsy/etc they appear to be.

All fer this 'un!

Andre



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OK Hogger
Engine Wiper

Posted - 06/08/2016 :  11:33:56 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
A quick follow up:

Re: "Metal" plated plastic drivers...

BAD idea. I already see places where the ultra-thin plating is chipping off. No way this would hold up to use. So much for these 56" drivers!

Next issue: Cleaned up the frame and burnished the axle slots with a wire brush in my Dremel on slow speed to give them a polished surface for easier rolling. (As opposed to the axles being seated on raw pewter.) Also burnished the axles themselves (some light rust on them). Surprise: The axles will not set down into the axle slots! Nope, too big. Neither does an MDC axle. (Both the AM and MDC axles measure about .124".) So, the axle slots are undersized! Still rubbin' my chin on figurin' out a way to slightly enlarge the axle slots without getting them out of perpendicular/etc. Hm. May have to do what I did with one of my MDC frames way back when: File out and bush with a piece of brass "U" channel.

Whew... looks to me like I've bought me a pile of parts! Certainly not a "kit" thus far! Not cool.

MUCH rework will be required to try to retain the dimensions of the "as designed" kit. Beginning to think about possibly grafting the AM parts onto an MDC chassis/MDC drivers. Then there's that Brooks driver spacing I would want to retain, though.

Hmmm.

Yup... should'a hollered at all you TOC19 vets here on this list about Arbour Models before I laid out the loot!!!

Andre

EDIT: FWIW, just measured an MDC 52" Mogul frame and the overall wheelbase is almost exact. (Within a few thousandths.) The mismatch is the center driver on the MDC, it's about .125" too far forward. More "Hmmm" fodder.

Also, there's enough "meat" on an MDC 0-6-0 frame to mill a new center axle slot in the correct location, and mill a rear slot in the correct location. Even more "Hmmm" fodder!



Edited by - OK Hogger on 06/08/2016 11:45:26 PM

Country: | Posts: 414 Go to Top of Page

railman28
Fireman



Posted - 06/09/2016 :  12:48:32 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by OK Hogger

A quick follow up:


Whew... looks to me like I've bought me a pile of parts! Certainly not a "kit" thus far! Not cool.



Yes, that an Arbour "Kit" alright. I got a 12 x 20 Sagami to fit in the Brook's boiler after a whole lot of grinding with my Dermel. I used a small rat tail file IIRC to open the wheel slots.

One day I will get my buckets of parts running but It's a real low priority because of options on motive power.


It's only make-believe

Country: USA | Posts: 4689 Go to Top of Page

OK Hogger
Engine Wiper

Posted - 06/12/2016 :  12:16:38 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
An update to the update!

Been a productive week. Check out the growth of the growing rolling stock fleet for the ol' Colorado & Pacific:





Of course, each and every piece will have to get Kadee's, some minor modifications (adding formed wire corner steps, paint/decals, etc), but all in good time. Right now the goal is get them gathered up and on the shelf.

Also purchased a round of structures. Stumbled upon a batch of Kibri "Old West" structure kits (3 structures to a kit) and purchased them, as well as a Bachamann "Old West" type of double kit. The above will yield 11 structures for use in the larger of the towns. That's a good start.

My hope is to experiment with ideas that have been shared on this forum and come up with some paint formulas/techniques to represent various types of aged Colorado wood for use on them.

Shucks though, even box stock, they don't look too bad when set into an acceptably realistic scene. To wit, check out this advertisement photo that Kibri must have used in the dateless past:



Not bad! I think with a bit of effort to tone down the clunkier parts, as well as administering the aforementioned Colorado-type weathered wood "look"... these are going to be fine and dandy to build my boom towns with!

Oh, and I received a NIB MDC/Roundhouse Mogul kit w/52" drivers. This is one of the later kits with nickle silver drivers and tender wheels. I have already dressed the frame with a file, burnished the axle slots, and installed the drivers, side rods, and motor. Runs "okay"... but I still think it needs a better quality motor than the little one that MDC provided.

Lessee'... anything else? Nope, I guess that about catches it.

All fer now!

Andre



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