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bcfan1064
Engine Wiper
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 Posted - 05/05/2009 : 7:29:07 PM
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I picked this caboose up at the CCMRC train show it is an old wood side die cast model with some old paint. I have a few questions about refinishing it.
1. Should I strip as much of that paint as possible?
2. What should I use to strip the paint?
3. The wood is in good shape but I don't want to sand to much of it because of the detail in the sides.
4. What kind of glue is typically used for bonding these kinds of models? It doesn't look like regular CA was used because the window plastic wasn't "Fogged up".
5. It is missing a few parts. I should be able to find most of them in brass or just make them.
Please if you have some advice to give I would really like to see this caboose can ride again. I think it has potential. What about you?
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Country: USA
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bcfan1064
Engine Wiper
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Posted - 05/06/2009 : 6:42:26 PM
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I dont mean to sound like a neady SOB. I was just trying to bounce some ideas off of the experts that frequent the site. The forum has been a valueable resource for me and many others. I really like to see the layout updates and the modeling work that everyone has done.
Thank you
Barry S
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Country: USA
| Posts: 164 |
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northern6400
Fireman
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Posted - 05/06/2009 : 9:52:09 PM
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Barry you have a real challange there. I would take off the wood parts and strip the metal parts with brake fluid or other methods mentioned here. It is difficult to see what condition the wood siding is in but trying to strip paint off the wood is the challenge. You may just want to replace the wood sides with new wood or plastic siding. Good luck.
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Chuck Faist
Burlington, Ontario
Enjoy yourself it is later than you think! |
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Country: Canada
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AVRR-PA
Fireman
Premium Member
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Posted - 05/06/2009 : 10:16:09 PM
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Hi, Barry --
This seems like a worthwile project, to me at least. I love to see old kits built or restored to useful life.
I would try one of the citrus-based strippers on the wood parts - I think the one that's sold at Home Depot is called "Citri-Strip" or something like that. It's reasonably mild, slow acting, unlikely to kill you, etc. Try it on a small patch and use it in small quantities so you don't soak the wood and warp it.
For gluing it back together - I fond of Weldbond but there are a lot of alternatives. Weldbond forms a surprisingly strong bond between wood and metal.
Have fun and keep posting pictures as you go along.
Don
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Country: USA
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emccamey
Crew Chief
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Posted - 05/06/2009 : 10:59:59 PM
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Given it's apparent age and seeing those flanges, the model may well have been glued with old Ambroid cement. That could be a real challenge as Ambroid would "rekit" after about 10-12 years. Typically it will crystallize and just come apart.
Some of the joints are a bit 'kilter' - but not too bad. You'll want to reinforce the seams with some ACC and if you can get to the insides - perhaps some posts.
Rather than attempt actual stripping on the wood - I'd just LIGHTLY brush and use Q-tips in some 91% or (99%) alcohol and do a repaint with a light gray as a new primer. Carefully sand or scrape any excessive blobs or irregularities that then protrude.
If you can remove those roof walks and replace with much finer materials - it would give it a good refurbishing. REPLACE THE WHEELS!
-ed-
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Country: USA
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bitlerisvj
Crew Chief
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Posted - 05/07/2009 : 11:56:52 AM
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Hi Barry,
In my (humble) opinion, this is a great project to get something trackworthy. As one of the folks sugested, it may have been put together with Ambroid. If Ambroid was used, you can easily disassemble it using Acetone, available from Home depot. This is obviously a Silver Streak Caboose. If the trucks are basically sound, you can replace the wheelsets with P2K's or Kadees and with a bit of Greasem (graphite) on the axle ends, they should be good rollers, since they are equalized and sprung.
I am working on a similiar Side Door Silver Streak caboose that I would like to turn into an Illinois Central one when I find decals.
I was able to remove the sides by carefully prying them off. The adhesive was old and gave it up easily. I suggest a little acetone first. If acetone doesn't cut it, then maybe white glue was used and the sides can be carefully pried apart or drip a tiny bit of water in the seam. The sides are made out of very nice grooved plywood, NOT basswood. I plan on using Lacquer thinner carefully painted on the sides and then wiping with a cloth until all paint is removed. I know this will take a while, but will be much better than sanding. Once the paint is gone, I plan on using a scriber to get the remainder of the paint out of the grooves. For the metal parts, you can just soak them in lacquer thinner until the paint comes off. I ALWAYS use lacquer thinner outside and wear nitril or latex gloves. Be careful with the gloves and toss them as soon as they start to melt.
Good luck with that and I am sure you will have a lot of fun.
Regards, Vic Bitleris
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Country: USA
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bitlerisvj
Crew Chief
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Posted - 05/07/2009 : 12:04:02 PM
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Hi again,
I forgot a couple of other questions you had.
If you want new parts, Ye Olde Huff N' Puff has them.
http://www.yeoldehuffnpuff.com/
But, you may wish to use newer, better ones or scratchbuild some.
I plan on using 5 minute epoxy to glue the wood to the metal. That seems to work the best. It is not the easiest to work with, but once setup, will not fall apart on you when you work it. For wood, that is up to you. I use Elmers yellow glue, but a lot of folks use Titebond.
Regards, Vic Bitleris
quote:
Originally posted by bitlerisvj
Hi Barry,
In my (humble) opinion, this is a great project to get something trackworthy. As one of the folks sugested, it may have been put together with Ambroid. If Ambroid was used, you can easily disassemble it using Acetone, available from Home depot. This is obviously a Silver Streak Caboose. If the trucks are basically sound, you can replace the wheelsets with P2K's or Kadees and with a bit of Greasem (graphite) on the axle ends, they should be good rollers, since they are equalized and sprung.
I am working on a similiar Side Door Silver Streak caboose that I would like to turn into an Illinois Central one when I find decals.
I was able to remove the sides by carefully prying them off. The adhesive was old and gave it up easily. I suggest a little acetone first. If acetone doesn't cut it, then maybe white glue was used and the sides can be carefully pried apart or drip a tiny bit of water in the seam. The sides are made out of very nice grooved plywood, NOT basswood. I plan on using Lacquer thinner carefully painted on the sides and then wiping with a cloth until all paint is removed. I know this will take a while, but will be much better than sanding. Once the paint is gone, I plan on using a scriber to get the remainder of the paint out of the grooves. For the metal parts, you can just soak them in lacquer thinner until the paint comes off. I ALWAYS use lacquer thinner outside and wear nitril or latex gloves. Be careful with the gloves and toss them as soon as they start to melt.
Good luck with that and I am sure you will have a lot of fun.
Regards, Vic Bitleris
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Country: USA
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bcfan1064
Engine Wiper
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Posted - 05/07/2009 : 10:12:43 PM
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Thank you for the advice unfortunatly one of the trucks was in bad shape it crumbled as soon as i touched it. The other truck looks similar but newer. I will have to start making a list of "bits" to find.
Thank you
Barry S
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Country: USA
| Posts: 164 |
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Glen Haasdyk
Crew Chief
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Posted - 05/07/2009 : 11:40:18 PM
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I think I have the same caboose. I picked mine up at a swap meet when I was 15. Unfortunetly I didn't get the end platforms or steps with it to I cut up an athearn caboose floor to rebuild it. I remember I painted it a very bright red with CNR maple leaf decals. Years later I took it apart to 'restore' it but I used brake fluid to strip the paint on the wooden sides and ruined them. I made new sides from scribed styrene but thats as far as I got. All the parts are still in a box, waiting to be resurected some day. I think both the cupula and ends on the car ere cast metal and all the other parts were wood.
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Country: Canada
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bitlerisvj
Crew Chief
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Posted - 05/08/2009 : 09:12:50 AM
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Hi Barry,
You can go a couple of ways with the trucks. I personally like Kadee arch bar trucks for that era of caboose, but Tichy also makes some very nice caboose trucks. I would replace the wheels ets of the Tichy trucks, because they are plastic.
Regards, Vic Bitleris
quote:
Originally posted by bcfan1064
Thank you for the advice unfortunatly one of the trucks was in bad shape it crumbled as soon as i touched it. The other truck looks similar but newer. I will have to start making a list of "bits" to find.
Thank you
Barry S
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Country: USA
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bcfan1064
Engine Wiper
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Posted - 05/18/2009 : 9:29:07 PM
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I found a source for the trucks. I started stripping the model I got it all broke down into pieces now and all of the metal parts are stripped of paint. Unfortunatly the sides didn't strip well and i will have to make new ones. I am now on the search for some new sides. I want them to be wood and i will be making them out of basswood. I will scribe them to look like the originals. I am thankful for the help everyone. Keep up the good work.
Barry S
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Country: USA
| Posts: 164 |
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bitlerisvj
Crew Chief
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Posted - 05/19/2009 : 08:52:29 AM
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Hi Barry,
You can buy scribed siding from Northeastern. I suggest to use 1/32 thick and I use 1/32 spacing, but if you wish you can use 3/64 spacing. It will be a lot easier than trying to scribe it yourself and the cost is nominal. Of course, you will need to glue two pieces butted together, because a sheet will probably not be wide enough. Usually your LHS can get it in a week or less if they do not stock it already.
I think I will strip my old Silver Streak caboose this weekend and I will try to save the sides, because I like the strength of the scribed plywood. Hopefully, they won't become unlaminated. When I am done, I will post pictures of the re-kitted parts. I am not sure what kind of trucks I will put under it. I am going to try to be correct for Illinois Central. Anyone care to help on what style should be used?
Regards, Vic Bitleris.
quote:
Originally posted by bcfan1064
I found a source for the trucks. I started stripping the model I got it all broke down into pieces now and all of the metal parts are stripped of paint. Unfortunatly the sides didn't strip well and i will have to make new ones. I am now on the search for some new sides. I want them to be wood and i will be making them out of basswood. I will scribe them to look like the originals. I am thankful for the help everyone. Keep up the good work.
Barry S
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Country: USA
| Posts: 930 |
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bcfan1064
Engine Wiper
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Posted - 05/19/2009 : 8:21:27 PM
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Do be careful sripping the sides the Citristrip I used worked so well it took the detail right off the sides right down to the wood. So no the sides are flat, no board detail. The metal pieces are good and the roof. Thanks for the Northeastern suggestion. I will have to visit a LHS soon to get some of my list in my inventory. Cant wait to see the IC Bobber Vic!!!
-Barry S
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Country: USA
| Posts: 164 |
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Glen Haasdyk
Crew Chief
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Posted - 05/19/2009 : 11:05:08 PM
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Now I've gotten mine out of storage and am lookng to finish it. I found that since I'm replacing the sides (ruined the same way your's were Barry) I have to laminate a couple layers of styrene together to make the thickness of the originals. Hope someone starts posting pictures soon!
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Country: Canada
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bitlerisvj
Crew Chief
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Posted - 05/20/2009 : 08:55:58 AM
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Hi Glen,
Styrene is also a very good choice, but you should not need to laminate a couple of pieces. Evergreen sells all different thicknesses scribed at various spacing. I will guess .030 or .040 thickness and spacing would do. The scribed spacing is a personal choice. Considering the fragility of the scribed basswood, (I am re-doing an old Central Valley caboose currently and making new sides) I would strongly consider using styrene scribed siding and with the styrene that Evergreen sells, you probably do not need to glue two pieces together to make one side, but with styrene that would not be a problem anyway.
Regards, Vic Bitleris
quote:
Originally posted by Glen Haasdyk
Now I've gotten mine out of storage and am lookng to finish it. I found that since I'm replacing the sides (ruined the same way your's were Barry) I have to laminate a couple layers of styrene together to make the thickness of the originals. Hope someone starts posting pictures soon!
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Country: USA
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Glen Haasdyk
Crew Chief
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Posted - 05/20/2009 : 6:22:40 PM
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Thanks Vic, but I had already bought fairly thin scribed styrene so that is what I might be using. When I say might I'm going to try to re-scribe the siding on the original sides first. I was looking at them last night and thought that I don't have much to lose trying that way.
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Country: Canada
| Posts: 780 |
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