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 36 / 42 TON SHAY DRAWING
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Coaltrain
Fireman

1383 Posts

Posted - 12/26/2019 :  1:41:22 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I am looking for a scale drawing of a 36/42 ton shay drawing, preferably with the extended wagon top boiler (later version), but anything is better that what I have now, which is nothing. I plan to start a scratch build of a 42 ton shay,

thanks

TRAINS1941
Engineer

USA
12647 Posts

Posted - 12/26/2019 :  4:22:59 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I can't wait. What scale you using??

Jerry

"And in the end, itís not the years in your life that count. It's the life in your years." A. Lincoln
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Coaltrain
Fireman

1383 Posts

Posted - 12/27/2019 :  12:51:38 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I will be building in O scale, actual gauge is On3. I am going to use my 3D resin printer to print all the parts for test fitting, then cast them in brass. The boiler, cab, and tender will be photo etched brass. The goal is to make all three of the Babcock shays (2, 5, and 8). I was using Kemtron shay kits to start but so much has been modified that the only parts from the kits I am using are the wheel sets.

I have a corrected builder photo and a few known dimensions, from that I have been scaling dimensions but it would be a lot easier if I had some actual drawings. there is one (part of one) shay that is a few hour drive from me in a museum that I may have to go to in order to get some critical dimensions if I can't get a drawing, assuming they will let me get close to it with a tape measure.

the drive will be the hardest part. The Kemtron shays use micro motors with a Grandt Line conversion gear set, all of which I have, however the micro motors are coreless motors and they don't play well with the TCS Wow decoders that I want to use. I am currently using Loksound decoders and they work well with coreless motors but I want some of the features that the Wow decoders offer that Loksound does not. Also, the Grandt Line drive uses the rear axle of the rear truck as the driving wheel, then transmits the power up through the line shaft to the front truck. I want to do what PSC does and drive the shay from the cylinders and then out the line shafts, this will allow me to use a can motor instead of the coreless motor. these days it is very hard to repower anything because the parts are not available like they used to be. I have been using gears out of plastic locomotives as my test donors, once I get the reduction I need I have to figure out how to get the pieces I used, or just buy more of the donor locomotives since I only am building three shays.

here is the mock up 3D model, right now the focus is only on getting the drive set up, all the details are in rough shaping stages, the boiler is there just to know how much room I have to work with.



here is my side drawing I made from the builders photo.


here is the 3D model of a 42 ton shay cylinder set, it is in two halves so the crank shaft will be serviceable.

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BurleyJim
Fireman

USA
5587 Posts

Posted - 12/27/2019 :  8:49:41 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
What are you drawing with? Are you planning on lost foam casting? I haven't seen any lost plastic castings yet.


Jim

Take the red pill
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Bernd
Fireman

USA
3630 Posts

Posted - 12/28/2019 :  08:07:36 AM  Show Profile  Visit Bernd's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by BurleyJim

What are you drawing with? Are you planning on lost foam casting? I haven't seen any lost plastic castings yet.


Jim




I'm wondering if he skipped a couple of steps there. It should go, 3D resin print a percentage bigger to take care of metal shrinkage, make a rubber mold with master resin print, make wax copies, cast in investment plaster, burn out wax, cast brass parts. I think I got the procedure correct.

Bernd

WWG1WGA
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Coaltrain
Fireman

1383 Posts

Posted - 12/28/2019 :  09:34:18 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
these parts are being printed in actual size in Resin so I can test what the final parts should fit like. this way I can assemble the model and test the drive with all resin parts. then I will scale up the parts by 2% (which I have to check but I believe that is the shrinkage rate). Then I will print the parts in "Powercast Burn" resin to get the masters. here is a link to casting with Burn https://youtu.be/hqD0l8zvkzM . at that point I am either going to have to get the equipment to do the casting myself or find someone to do the casting for me.

By making the parts first in actual size I can check the casting to see if I have to make any adjustments in the scaling of the parts so the casting come out actual size.

These days with the castable resins it eliminates a few steps from the casting process. if this works out I will get the equipment to cast my own parts for future.
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BurleyJim
Fireman

USA
5587 Posts

Posted - 12/28/2019 :  10:14:30 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I guess you missed the what are you drawing the parts with question. What resin printer do you have to take on such a large part? I bought a small resin printer to do some fine detail work, that the FDM printer only has .2 mm resolution with. The 11" X 30" build size on the FDM covers most of the rest.

Jim

Take the red pill
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railman28
Fireman

USA
5673 Posts

Posted - 12/28/2019 :  4:03:30 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Coaltrain



By making the parts first in actual size I can check the casting to see if I have to make any adjustments in the scaling of the parts so the casting come out actual size.

These days with the castable resins it eliminates a few steps from the casting process. if this works out I will get the equipment to cast my own parts for future.



I used Shapeways to do my resin printing and my brass casting. Using the resin prints as you described above. On the Shrinkage I found that the outside dimensions shrank while things like holes and slots enlarged. About 1.5%.

Bob

It's only make-believe
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Coaltrain
Fireman

1383 Posts

Posted - 12/30/2019 :  07:10:29 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
that's good to know about the shrinkage being different. I am sure it will take a failed part or two to get where I want to be.

The resin printer I am using is an Epax X1, it does not have a very big build tray but I am only going to print the cylinders, trucks, smokebox front, stack, domes, and some detail parts. the frame I am going to fabricate from scratch because all three of my shays are different enough that I could not use the same frame if it were a casting. I also plan to use real wood on the decking as I did on my previous 26 ton shay build. I like the look of the real wood where there was wood on the prototype.

here is the 26 ton shay with the wood decking




after paint
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JGDURAND
Engine Wiper

France
183 Posts

Posted - 12/31/2019 :  06:17:08 AM  Show Profile  Visit JGDURAND's Homepage  Reply with Quote
[:-thumbu] [:-thumbu]

http://www.railroad-line.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=49171&whichpage=5
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Ray Dunakin
Fireman

USA
3308 Posts

Posted - 12/31/2019 :  9:59:55 PM  Show Profile  Visit Ray Dunakin's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Wow, that Shay looks awesome!
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