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RyanAK
Engine Wiper

USA
302 Posts

Posted - 01/16/2020 :  08:59:04 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
That's a neat thought to model too... a station master's house. Adds to the story for sure. Once the Dinky book arrives, I'll share what info I can learn. I think we have a pretty good design here. Rob's design in 72". Single-siding Werley terminal if 8' is available. Pretty nifty.

I've looked at several larger industries with an eye to a one-industry layout. I'm still researching early tanneries to try to figure out the rail traffic patterns. But I've found out a LOT about wood chemical plants, often called 'acid plants' or 'acid works'. Here's some interesting numbers and a look at the process:

* Smaller plants before conversion to 'jumbo' retorts could process 10-20 cords of smaller hardwood logs. A cord is 4'x8'x4' or 128 cu ft. That's 1-2 carloads each day of hardwood.
* The retorts at the turn of the century were fairly standardized at 5' in diameter, 112" long with a 3/4 cord capacity.
* The wood was stored outdoors and was then hand-loaded into carts, wheeled into the building, hand-loaded into the retorts.
* The wood was then heated to produce Charcoal, methanol, and acetate of lime.
* At the end of the process, the solids were raked out of the retort into cooling cans and placed in a large cooling room.
* (1) cord of wood produced:
10 gal of methanol
200 lbs acetate of lime
50 bushels (1000 lbs) of charcoal
* So a "big" small wood chemical plant processing 20 cords would be producing 200 gal of methanol, 4000lbs of acetate of lime, and 20,000 lbs of charcoal.
* The acetate of lime was the big money product, used in making acetic acid. Some plants would have the extractor to do the process on site, others shipped the acetate to a chemical company as bulk batch product.

I think this would make a very interesting model and has a variety of rail traffic in and out on a consistent basis. Maybe too consistent to be a standalone industry on a layout. More thought needed...



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Michael Hohn
Fireman

USA
6117 Posts

Posted - 01/16/2020 :  10:22:08 AM  Show Profile  Visit Michael Hohn's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I think the most alluring aspect of the rural chemical industry is the number of modest-sized buildings. Almost like a craftsman kit. All those different rooflines, vents, cupolas, stacks, gables and lean-to’s.

Mike
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deemery
Fireman

USA
8259 Posts

Posted - 01/16/2020 :  10:56:10 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
What Mike said! Plus its very rarely modeled.

dave

Modeling 1890s (because the voices in my head told me to)
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RyanAK
Engine Wiper

USA
302 Posts

Posted - 01/16/2020 :  11:13:22 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Isn't it neat? It would look so good as a model on a layout. It would be a lot of fun to scratch all of those structures, though the roof geometry would take some planning. Flats, gons and boxcars inbound with hardwood and misc. supplies. Boxcars, tankers (maybe... liquids may have shipped in barrels) out.

Anyone know how industrial charcoal was shipped? I believe a lot of the charcoal went to small furnaces (before coke completely took over) rather than retail sale. Boxcar? Gondola? Hopper? Hmmm...
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railman28
Fireman

USA
5550 Posts

Posted - 01/16/2020 :  1:14:48 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
It is neat. Cold be tucked into a corner too.

Bob

It's only make-believe
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Michael Hohn
Fireman

USA
6117 Posts

Posted - 01/16/2020 :  2:42:19 PM  Show Profile  Visit Michael Hohn's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I’m working my way through a dissertation by a friend, Vagel Keller. Here’s one of his illustrations:



He states that once the charcoal was unloaded from the retorts it was placed in airtight iron tubs to extinguish the embers, then spread across a floor to air cool for two days. It was then packed in sacks for storage and shipment.

Mike

Edited by - Michael Hohn on 01/16/2020 2:48:59 PM
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deemery
Fireman

USA
8259 Posts

Posted - 01/16/2020 :  2:53:58 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
For some reason "boxcar" came immediately to mind when you asked about shipping charcoal. In part that's because that load would need to be protected from the rain. It would be a kinda dirty load if the charcoal wasn't pre-bagged.

And the book Vagel mentioned was the one I was thinking of, but couldn't remember its title or find it in my library.

dave

Modeling 1890s (because the voices in my head told me to)

Edited by - deemery on 01/16/2020 2:54:35 PM
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Michael Hohn
Fireman

USA
6117 Posts

Posted - 01/16/2020 :  5:53:18 PM  Show Profile  Visit Michael Hohn's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Ryan,

At this point in time, how are you planning to stage your trains?

Mike
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robert goslin
Fireman

Australia
2271 Posts

Posted - 01/16/2020 :  6:23:53 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hello Ryan. Just catching up on your work.
You are putting a lot of time into research, which is great.
I really like all the old photos you're posting.
And great to see so many folks here helping with ideas and suggestions.
They all have a vast amount of knowledge to tap into.

[:-thumbu]

Regards
Rob Goslin

A Warped Barrel is a Fool's Frustration - Maxwell Smart.
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RyanAK
Engine Wiper

USA
302 Posts

Posted - 01/16/2020 :  9:02:20 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Hey, fellas. This place is great. Kindred spirits. I absolutely love the research. And the design. The guys on this forum are a wealth of knowledge and I so very much appreciate the participation. I only post one other place, and there isn’t quite as much enthusiasm for this kind of stuff. Useful participation in other ways, but I dig it here with you guys. Hope what I contribute is found interesting.

Mike, planning to have a 48” removable or drop-leaf extension on the right with a three-track traverser and a loco escape lead. This makes for a really compact yard where two full trains can be staged and have a runaround track always clear. British modelers seem to use it a lot for staging (fiddle yard)... simply for feeding and receiving trains. The yard lead (just the length of the locomotive) allows the engine to decouple and run around the trains in the ‘yard’. I came up with this for my Loganton design. Sonestown will have traversers at each end but include turntables rather than simple escape leads so engines can be turned in staging. It makes more sense with pictures. I’ll see what I can sketch up tomorrow.
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Hawghead
Section Hand

58 Posts

Posted - 01/17/2020 :  1:33:04 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by OK Hogger

Hey Hawghead:

Going by your nickname and avatar, I'm inclined to believe you have (or had) something to do with railroading, engineer in particular. Do I have it right?

Retired railroader here.

Andre



Andre,

You have it right. I'm an engineer for the Union Pacific Railroad. I'm currently on the "east pool" Portland Or. to Hermiston, Or.

Scott

There's a prototype for everything.
If you can't make it perfect, make it adjustable.
DCC is not plug and play.
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neiler
New Hire

USA
18 Posts

Posted - 01/20/2020 :  2:43:44 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Ryan - Too bad you don’t have room for a small wye, even with a fold up leg, but a turntable is cool. I’d be tempted to add a Cemetary switch, and come off the closest side on the left of the layout for a small turntable. That would leave more room for the station between the track, a decent rail track, and road to Werley’s big city center (lol). Add a backdrop with the tavern and me sitting on the porch with a pint.
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RyanAK
Engine Wiper

USA
302 Posts

Posted - 01/20/2020 :  3:12:39 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Cemetery switch? No sure what ya mean there, Neil. I have thought about separating the switching lead from the turntable track... I might have to doodle it. I'd absolutely prefer a wye, but I don't think there's quite the space to make it work, even in HOn3. May need to print some templates and see just how much space an HOn3 wye does take...

I like finding these historic photos taken from the perfect perspective to use as a backdrop. Werley is in a little hollow between to mountains... one street. You can see just about the whole thing in that photo.

Fun stuff, eh?
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RyanAK
Engine Wiper

USA
302 Posts

Posted - 01/21/2020 :  2:26:25 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
I'm still working on a few other small, early layout designs... including some single-industry layouts for out time period. I'm going to keep this thread going for "stations and terminals"... the sort of thing we worked through with Werley... and start new individual topics for each industry. Hope you guys will jump in on those topics as well!

R
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RyanAK
Engine Wiper

USA
302 Posts

Posted - 01/24/2020 :  09:50:36 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
So, I picked up the book on the C&NW narrow gauge in Wisconsin called “The Dinky”. I was a little concerned that this would be a local history sort of book rather than a railroading book. On page one there’s a quote something along the lines of “this charming scene evokes a simpler time when things moved at a slower pace.”

Ugh.



Well a few pages in and I was completely amazed and the depth of research put into this little $18 book, complete with excellent photos, maps, and TECHNICAL DRAWINGS! Station trackage, depot drawings, locomotive and rolling stock drawings, color notes (the coach was yellow... blah.). This is a historian and model builder’s dream book. You could easily, accurately, and prototypically model this narrow gauge railroad from this book alone. It’s incredible.

BTW... full drawings of the Werley depot... the freight room was two narrow gauge boxcars placed back to back!!



Best railroad history bargain I’ve found in a long time. Makes a C&NW narrow gauge layout completely achievable.

R
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