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Peterpools
Engineer

USA
12335 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2010 :  06:18:04 AM  Show Profile  Visit Peterpools's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Cliff
Talk about faster then a speeding bullet, able to leap tall buildings in a single bounce....
I'm speechless how fast you were able to redo the interior.
Exceptionally well done.
Peter
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Grubes
Engine Wiper

USA
356 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2010 :  07:13:47 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Cliff,

Definitely worth it. Having followed your work for a long time I get the feeling you would have never been satisfied knowing that the tower, as originally modeled, was not prototypical.

The modeling, like the rest of your work, is superb.

Dave
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Bbags
Administrator

USA
13132 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2010 :  10:29:55 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Cliff,
The interior looks excellent.
I would have someone give the toilet a flush when they have a chance.

As a side note I notice our newest member of Railroad-Line is one Dr Muff.
Hopefully he will become active on the forum.


John Bagley
Modeling the Alaska Railroad in HO in Wildwood Georgia.
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Dave S
Engine Wiper

USA
320 Posts

Posted - 02/14/2010 :  11:55:27 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Cliff,

Two thumbs up for your efforts and results. Definitely worth the time to get it just as you know it was historically. I received a similar sort of inside information regarding a passenger station I'm scratch building and reworked the model just as you have done.

Later, Dave S. Tucson, AZ
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maandg
Engine Wiper

437 Posts

Posted - 02/15/2010 :  08:39:30 AM  Show Profile  Visit maandg's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Thanks Mark, Peter, Dave(s) and John! Believe it or not, I actually completed the interior in two long afternoons. If I did drink coffee, I could've done it one! [:-bigeyes2]

John, I was not aware that Nick (Muff) had joined the forum. This is great news! I only hope he will grace us with photos of his astounding Kansas City Union Station. I have countless photos of it that he has sent over the last several years, but I felt it wasn't my place to present them here. I think everyone will be blown away with what he has accomplished.

I did get the concrete foundations for the REA painted yesterday. Today I begin painting and weathering the trusses. Hopefully, I'll have this next huge project wrapped up by the end of Spring Break in late March. I'll keep you guys posted!

Thanks again for the comments!

Cliff Powers
The Mississippi Alabama & Gulf
Please visit my layout website at
www.magnoliaroute.com
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Orionvp17
Fireman

USA
3643 Posts

Posted - 02/15/2010 :  09:03:47 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Cliff,

Not only is the new interior elegant, but that it was done in a couple of days is, well, astounding, especially considering that it was done "in situ," as it were. What's the secret to working in a place where I probably can't get my fingers?

Nicely done!

Pete
in Michigan
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maandg
Engine Wiper

437 Posts

Posted - 02/15/2010 :  09:35:36 AM  Show Profile  Visit maandg's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Thanks for your response, Pete. First, not having any experience with Latin, I have to admit that I had to Google the translation to your question! [:-dunce]

Would you believe that I did the renovation work with the overhead LED wires still in place? Luckily, the Interlocking machine was able to be contorted between the LEDs on long tweezers. The floor was the trickiest part, but being cardstock, it bent easily to slide in place. When I removed the paper walls, I was able to use them as a template for the new Plastruct material. That was the easiest install.

The hardest thing for me isn't getting the components in place, but in place just exactly where I want them, before the glue dries or leaves a stain. Being a bit of a perfectionist, this often causes me considerable headaches. My other aggravation is dealing with anything I perceive as a "step backwards". In this case, however, I think the end justified the means. Glad you like it!

Cliff Powers
The Mississippi Alabama & Gulf
Please visit my layout website at
www.magnoliaroute.com
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Frederic Testard
Engineer

France
17603 Posts

Posted - 02/15/2010 :  1:09:03 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Wow, Cliff, I had missed the end of page 2 and was quietly waiting for you to redo the interior, and it was already done. Very impressive, and very beautiful.

Frederic Testard
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PortEmerson
Engine Wiper

215 Posts

Posted - 02/15/2010 :  9:25:16 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Cliff, more great work, you've taken a small project and knocked it out of the park!!

Absolutely love what you did with the new interior!!

Joe
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maandg
Engine Wiper

437 Posts

Posted - 02/15/2010 :  10:28:19 PM  Show Profile  Visit maandg's Homepage  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by akimmons


Sounds like you have lots of structures to build. Do you have an overall view or trackplan of the facility so we can visualize where everything will go?




Arnold, I spent some time today putting the finishing touches on my updated track plan for the third level. I have labeled all of the major structures; particularly those connected with the NOUPT. This should help you visualize the overall plan as I move forward through construction.



Here is a close-up of just the NOUPT sections. The small writing should be a little easier to read.



As you can see, there are numerous structures left to build for this area alone. I'll probably re-post the plan photo from time to time for newcomers to the thread.

I'm glad everyone seems in agreement over the re-furb to the tower. Many thanks for your feedback, everyone!


Cliff Powers
The Mississippi Alabama & Gulf
Please visit my layout website at
www.magnoliaroute.com
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Orionvp17
Fireman

USA
3643 Posts

Posted - 02/16/2010 :  09:49:58 AM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by maandg

Thanks for your response, Pete. First, not having any experience with Latin, I have to admit that I had to Google the translation to your question! [:-dunce]

Would you believe that I did the renovation work with the overhead LED wires still in place? Luckily, the Interlocking machine was able to be contorted between the LEDs on long tweezers. The floor was the trickiest part, but being cardstock, it bent easily to slide in place. When I removed the paper walls, I was able to use them as a template for the new Plastruct material. That was the easiest install.




You did it with the LED wires in place.... I really am awed! [:-bigeyes] That's even more impressive! You can rightly be proud of this effort.

Sorry about the Latin; it just slipped out....

Pete
in Michigan
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SteveH
Engine Wiper

Canada
457 Posts

Posted - 02/16/2010 :  8:19:38 PM  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Aw gee, Cliff. Prototypically accurate rebuild and you forgot the phone!!!
As if anyone will notice. (I won't tell!)[:-eyebrows]

I am just amazed that the rebuild was done in two afternoons.[:-bigeyes]

Great job as always.[:-thumbu][:-thumbu]

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maandg
Engine Wiper

437 Posts

Posted - 02/16/2010 :  10:57:32 PM  Show Profile  Visit maandg's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Oh yea, the telephone.

Ummm...back to the drawing board. [:-shake]

Cliff Powers
The Mississippi Alabama & Gulf
Please visit my layout website at
www.magnoliaroute.com
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Brunton
Engine Wiper

USA
418 Posts

Posted - 02/17/2010 :  07:26:47 AM  Show Profile  Visit Brunton's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Cliff,

I have to ask - while I'm absolutely in awe of your modeling skills in creating the upper deck structures, aren't the big-time railroading upper deck and the more rural branchline middle deck a bit mis-matched?

Will a lot of the trains from the upper deck progress all the way down the helix to staging and vice-versa, with only a limited number of trains passing through the middle deck? Or am I missing the concept completely?

http://www.thecbandqinwyoming.com
http://www.thecbandqinwyoming.blogspot.com
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maandg
Engine Wiper

437 Posts

Posted - 02/17/2010 :  11:57:24 PM  Show Profile  Visit maandg's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Thanks, Brunton!

You are quite correct that the conventional wisdom in multiple deck design is to have yards and large switching areas on the lower level and the narrower, rural scenes on the top. In my case, however, this was not possible. NOUPT is huge, and it was going to require the entire 4-foot by 19-foot center peninsula to be reasonable. This would also require that the space be free from any obstructions; including those necessary to support a level above it. It became apparent that the only way to create such a space was to locate it on the upper level. Now that final construction is well under way, I am pleased with this decision. I enjoy having the large, imposing structures (especially those with full interiors) near eye level. Below the passenger terminal, the second deck is divided into two halves length-wise which worked perfectly for the narrow rural Mississippi scenes. The coach yard and diesel facility take up an additional 2 foot by 14 foot space along the back wall.

On the division I model, the MA&G meets the Southern and GM&O at Slidell, LA and uses their shared track across Lake Pontchartrain into New Orleans. In exchange, these two railroads have running rights on MA&G trackage between Slidell and Mobile, AL. The second level depicts a small section of this shared line. The helix represents the transitional run between Edna, MS and New Orleans.

Only MA&G locals will do any switching on the second level. Westbound Southern and GM&O through freights will negotiate the second level, ascend the helix, stop at Peoples Ave yard to drop off cuts of cars, and then continue to upper level staging. Since L&N traffic also comes from the east but does not share MA&G trackage, its freight traffic will skip the second level completely and go directly from the staging level to Peoples Avenue yard. As for passenger trains, only those from the Southern, GM&O, and MA&G will run through the second level. And of those, only certain MA&G consists will make station stops (some are “limiteds”). All consists from these three railroads, passenger as well as freight, will exit or enter the lower staging level.

The NOUPT served the Southern, L&N, IC, SP, MoPac, KCS, and T&P. My modeler’s license will permit me to include the GM&O and MA&G as well. My main design consideration dealt with the way the NOUPT relates to the rest of the upper level. In theory, the People’s Avenue mainline track facilitates passenger trains coming from the east (MA&G, SRR, GM&O and L&N). It would not look plausible to see the Southern Pacific’s Sunset Limited approaching from the same direction. To eliminate this problem, I designed a five track staging yard which is hidden in the waterfront warehouses on the opposite side of the layout. This staging yard will serve many purposes, including simulating the home freight yards for L&N, SOU and GM&O. During select op sessions, a “guest” switcher from the IC, SP, MP, T&P or KCS might transfer a cut of freight cars to Peoples yard from this hidden staging. More importantly, it provides a point for all passenger consists from the west to originate or terminate.

I realize that this seems like a lot of traffic for a 5 track staging yard. The solution lies in the creation of a Sequence Timetable which will choreograph and schedule the movement of trains in and out of this yard so that both “western” freight and passenger consists are accommodated. These will be pre-staged in the yard prior to the op session. In a typical six hour trick (2 hour op session), five tracks will be adequate for the 6 or 7 trains arriving and departing to “swap places”. Keep in mind that most of the passenger trains in this yard only make an appearance once every 4 tricks, which equals a 24-hour day. When not scheduled, they will simply remain stored on the lower staging level until their next session comes up in the rotation.

One last benefit of the 5-track staging yard is that it allows trains coming from the west to enter from the left side of the layout and trains from the east to enter from the right. While these points of entry would have been miles away from the wye itself, it gives the right visual cues to operators. This is also in keeping with the directionally sincere aspect of the entire layout; east is right and west is left.

The NOUPT will require an operator to assume the role of the station master and oversee the traffic in and out of the facility. Because NOUPT movements will sometimes infringe on the freight yard (for example, express reefers will be taken to the icing platforms), he will work in concert with the yard master on occasion. On the prototype, arriving trains would turn on the wye and back into the main terminal building. After the motive power had cut off and headed for the diesel shop, a blue and orange NOUPT SW8 would spot the head-end equipment on mail and express tracks. Then the remaining consist would be taken to the coach yard for servicing and layover until needed. As the departure time neared, the train would be backed through the wash rack to the main concourse for loading. The return of head-end cars and motive power would complete the process for departure. All of these procedures will be simulated during an operating session and supported by the structures featured in this construction thread. This “layover servicing” will be much more interesting and challenging than simply having trains back in and leave. Combining this passenger activity with local and run-through mainline freight should provide lots of activity for a crew of 6 or so.

I’m sorry for the long, complicated answer, but I hope it helped answer your questions. Hopefully, it clarified my operational goals for the other readers as well. I really appreciate your interest!

Cliff Powers
The Mississippi Alabama & Gulf
Please visit my layout website at
www.magnoliaroute.com

Edited by - maandg on 02/18/2010 12:36:15 AM
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